As it stands, is there a single SHRED of evidence that the vaccine significantly lowers transmission?

chris155au

Active member
Shell, if you need an example of vaccine mandates, currently in this country, you will be ineligible for family assistance through Centrelink if your child is not vaccinated.

Vaccine mandates are not new or novel.
THESE type of vaccine mandates ARE!
 

Biggles53

New member
These rules and laws are not stagnant. And, why do they change? Because they must keep up with environmental and social changes. These laws and rules MUST evolve with these changes. Or the growth of society will be retarded.
Exactly…! And that’s why, all round the world, communities of humans have seen the sense to have their people vaccinated against various diseases. And why, in the cases of particular occupations, they have made that compulsory.
Does this mean that mistakes are never made, that changes to laws and policies don’t occur..? Of course not, we are after all fallible humans. And the world of science is continually refining the knowledge we have. But the arc of progress moves steadily upward. Those, like you apparently, who wish to bend that arc to suit their own personal needs at one time were treated harshly and either shunned or put out on the ice……now, we just shake our heads and laugh…
 

Biggles53

New member
From the article:

"When infected with the delta variant, a given contact was 65 percent less likely to test positive if the person from whom the exposure occurred was fully vaccinated with two doses of the Pfizer vaccine. With AstraZeneca, a given contact was 36 percent less likely to test positive if the person from whom the exposure occurred was fully vaccinated."

Tell me, how effective are the vaccines? 99% right?
Another ummmmmm….

That article (and your question) is about the capability to SPREAD the virus from a VACCINATED person. This whole thread was based upon the premise that vaccination DIDN’T reduce the spread.
The article clearly shows that it DOES reduce the spread. As a fully vaccinated person, I am 36% LESS LIKELY to pass on the disease than an infected UNvaccinated person will…! If I’d been vaccinated with Pfizer, the percentage would be even higher…

Is any of this sinking in…?
 

chris155au

Active member
Another ummmmmm….

That article (and your question) is about the capability to SPREAD the virus from a VACCINATED person. This whole thread was based upon the premise that vaccination DIDN’T reduce the spread.
No, this thread was based on a QUESTION: is there a single SHRED of evidence that the vaccine SIGNIFICANTLY lowers transmission? I wouldn't call 36% significant, would you?
 

chris155au

Active member
No, I’m talking about the general concept of communities looking after themselves…
So what about specifically with regard to COVID? What about the responsibility of vulnerable people, making wise decisions to protect themselves? Why should it be up to others to protect them?
 

Biggles53

New member
No, this thread was based on a QUESTION: is there a single SHRED of evidence that the vaccine SIGNIFICANTLY lowers transmission? I wouldn't call 36% significant, would you?
Ummmm (again)….yes it is! It’s even more significant if it’s a Pfizer vaxxed person….

Ok….baby steps.

You are an unvaccinated, uninfected person. You are standing in between 2 others. Both of them are infected with the virus, but one has been vaccinated and the other hasn’t.

Which one would you most prefer moved away from you…?

(silly answer in 5…4…3…)
 

Biggles53

New member
So what about specifically with regard to COVID? What about the responsibility of vulnerable people, making wise decisions to protect themselves? Why should it be up to others to protect them?
Because, in many occupations, THAT’S THEIR JOB…!!

Good grief….
 

Shellandshilo1956

Active member
Shell, if you need an example of vaccine mandates, currently in this country, you will be ineligible for family assistance through Centrelink if your child is not vaccinated.

Vaccine mandates are not new or novel.
ONE, this is just not true. And, just more misinformation. Your FTB(Family Tax Benefit) Part A payment from Centrelink, MAY only be reduced by up to $29.68 per fortnight. And, there are many exceptions regarding vaccine exemptions for your child. Do you really think that any responsible government will just let a family starve to death, because their kid is NOT immunized? Think!

Also, the CCS(Child Care Subsidy) is paid directly to the Childcare facility. And, unemployed parents may have little need for this service. But, even so, many of these centers will still accept the child, regardless if the child is vaccinated or not.

https://guides.dss.gov.au/family-assistance-guide/2/1/3/10

TWO, If your family is on Centrelink payments, then you must do what is required to continue receiving those payments. Just like you would expect to do working at any job. I am no child, or under any requirements or payments by Centrelink. This is no more a mandate, than getting to work on time. IMHO. You may as well be saying that a library card is a mandate for taking books out of the library!

THREE, Regardless of whether you are on Centrelink payments or not, this is a parental decision about their child's heath. NOT an individual decision about your own health. So if you want to say that a Covid-19 vaccine mandates for 98%+ of ALL unvaccinated Australian adults(children under12 are exempt), is the same as a requirement by Centrelink for the 2-3% of parents refusing to immunize their under 7yo children, then be my guest. To me it is just a false equivalence.

FOUR, even if vaccine mandates are not novel or new, this is not a justification for having them. So what is the point you are making? That being forced to stick something you don't want into your arm/body, is okay because this is not novel or new?

Exactly what were the mandates in place for the Asian Flu, the Hong Kong Flu, and the H1N1 Flu? What were the mandates in place for HIV/AIDS? Just more rationalized hype and theatrics.
 

Biggles53

New member
So if you want to say that a Covid-19 vaccine mandates for 98%+ of ALL unvaccinated Australian adults
What…?? Where are you getting that number from? Are you suggesting that 98% of adults are working in occupations that require vaccination…??

If so, sit down and I’ll teach you some Mathematics…
 

Shellandshilo1956

Active member
Exactly…! And that’s why, all round the world, communities of humans have seen the sense to have their people vaccinated against various diseases. And why, in the cases of particular occupations, they have made that compulsory.
Does this mean that mistakes are never made, that changes to laws and policies don’t occur..? Of course not, we are after all fallible humans. And the world of science is continually refining the knowledge we have. But the arc of progress moves steadily upward. Those, like you apparently, who wish to bend that arc to suit their own personal needs at one time were treated harshly and either shunned or put out on the ice……now, we just shake our heads and laugh…
My God what a bunch silly gibberish. I've never heard more platitudes, and parroted soundbites spewed out in one post.

This has nothing to do with my personal needs. This has everything to do with me making an informed personal choice. It is narrow-minded, arrogant, ignorant, and pompous people like you, who will always continue to prove, why a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. Fortunately, you social dinosaurs, will be the first to be weeded out of the human gene pool.

All you do is avoid and editorialize.

What does my informed decision have to do with your decision?
How am I bending the "Arc of Progress" to suit my personal needs?
How are vaccinated people threatened by unvaccinated people?
How are your personal rights, in any way, being threatened?
Do you even know what a vaccine is, or does to your muscle cells?
Do you even know what type of antibodies are produced by DNA or mRNA vaccines?
Do you know the difference between an antigen and a pathogen?
Do you think we should guilt-shame, and force unvaccinated people to become like the rest?
Do you even know how the immune system works. Or what its limitations are?
Do you even understand why even many doctors and healthcare workers refuse vaccinations?
Do you why our natural immune-induced antibodies or better than vaccine induced antibodies?
Do you care that we destroy the country, because of a dise3ase less lethal than the measles?

Never mind, you wouldn't have a clue!!

Those, like you apparently, who wish to bend that arc to suit their own personal needs at one time were treated harshly and either shunned or put out on the ice……now, we just shake our heads and laugh…
It is not only the scientists, and the well-informed who are laughing and shaking their heads at people like you. But even your leaders, and the Big Pharma industries, who are also laughing at you as well. But don't worry, they don't want you to think for yourself either!!

Sit. Stay. Good Boy.
 

Shellandshilo1956

Active member
What…?? Where are you getting that number from? Are you suggesting that 98% of adults are working in occupations that require vaccination…??

If so, sit down and I’ll teach you some Mathematics…
I seriously doubt that you can teach me any math that I don't already know. And, based on your question, my suspicions are confirmed. So let's just take baby-steps using simple arithmetic, okay?

131,380(total cases of Covid-19) - 25,486(total recoveries) - 1,461(total deaths) = 104,433(accumulated total cases). Therefore,

103,433 accumulated total cases) / 26M(pop of Australia x 100% = 0.4% OR 99.6% are not infected/recorded. And, do not need to be vaccinated.

Where unvaccinated/vaccinated people work is irrelevant. My point was that if such a large portion of the population is NOT even infected, then why should they all be FORCED to be vaccinated? Why should Australia be shut down, held to ransom, and our basic human rights be restricted? Clearly this is NOT a lethal disease, with only 27,123(0.1% of pop.) active cases throughout all of Australia. And with a 1.1% mortality rate, I would expect 98.9% of those cases also making full recoveries(26,824). This just insane!

 

Biggles53

New member
My point was that if such a large portion of the population is NOT even infected, then why should they all be FORCED to be vaccinated?
Yes, I thought there was a basic numeracy problem….

WHERE do you get the idea that ALL of the Australian population is going to be subject to a mandate…? From what I see and understand, the requirement is for people in certain occupations to be vaccinated…! And even they have a choice, albeit a Hobson’s choice….if they want to scream like children throwing a tantrum in a supermarket aisle “my rights, my rights…!” then fine….find another line of work!
 
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