Antivax movement imploding in Oz.

[Shellandshilo1956]

hey, I left it for you to decide which option you take ........nothing to do with whats good for me. if it was about what was good for me I'd have booted your arse out of here ages ago

If I had my way, your ass would be the first I'd boot out. You offer nothing, know nothing, defend nothing, and pretend and avoid everything.

I don't give a rats-ass whether you boot me out or not. Now, go back into your echo chamber and give your ego a good stroke! Just another dumb non-response I've come to expect!

 

[Linus]

You're beyond stupid, Shell. Is this a game or are you mentally retarded?

I've already explained it. How many times, you dopey lump?

And it goes to show you read absolutely nothing or comprehend nothing.

The vaccines have protected people against infection. Some can still get it but its mostly the unvaccinated who get seriously ill or die.

I've shown you the data from NSW health that demonstrates this. If you look at hospitalisations those who have had 4 shots constitute a miniscule proportion. It rises with less shots. And the unvaccinated form the majority of cases.

Unvaccinated people are more susceptible to the virus. As such you're a breeding ground for mutations as the virus replicates in you. You, the unvaxxed are resevoirs of mutation that allow the virus to break through into the vaxxed. I quoted elsewhere the virologist that explained this.

Vaccinated people are less likely to get infected, and if they are infected are less likely to get seriously ill or die. Some may, but far less than the unvaccinated. And all this has been empirically verified.

And you imbecile think that people should just leave it up to their immune systems and have no protection at all. Are you seriously that stupid or evil ????

It's laughable that you dismissed Covid as insignificant as measles. Do you realise hundreds of thousands around the globe died of measles and other diseases like polio without vaccinations. The cases are insignificant today precisely because of vaccines.

Vaccines , including the covid vaccines have saved millions of lives. Would you have rather given them no protection and let them get seriously ill or die?

Also, Shell, that 98% recovery is a BS figure that you antivaxxers invented. You assumed that about 2% die so rest recover. Think again, shit for brains.

Have you heard of long covid? And do you understand that if you get Covid and/or get reinfected from covid you increase the likelihood of blood clots, strokes and other comorbidites???

Go right ahead, idiot, exercise your freedom not to get jabbed but don't try to fool anyone that they are not being protected by the vaccine or that they're not protecting others.

 

[Shellandshilo1956]

The vaccines have protected people against infection. Some can still get it but its mostly the unvaccinated who get seriously ill or die.

No, dumb-dumb, the vaccine MAY prevent people from developing the illness. But NOTHING CAN STOP ANYONE FROM BEING INFECTED BY THE VIRUS! The overwhelming majority of people infected and dying from this disease are those vaccinated, NOT UNVACCINATED. Check the internet again. Think about it genius, if over 95% of the population is multi-vaccinated, then how the fuck could most of the people infected and dying from this virus, be from the unvaccinated?? You're just a parrot mindlessly parroting the same government soundbites and platitudes.

Unvaccinated people are more susceptible to the virus. As such you're a breeding ground for mutations as the virus replicates in you. You, the unvaxxed are resevoirs of mutation that allow the virus to break through into the vaxxed. I quoted elsewhere the virologist that explained this.

Vaccinated people are less likely to get infected, and if they are infected are less likely to get seriously ill or die. Some may, but far less than the unvaccinated. And all this has been empirically verified.

Stop bluffing! It is so annoying and distracting! Let me try this another way. How does the SARS-CoV-2 virus know the difference between a person who is vaccinated, and a person who isn't?? What is the mechanism that would allow it to selectively choose its host?? And, why would a virus need to mutate against an unvaccinated person? Viruses mutate to avoid being detected by the host's immune system.

Are you saying that the immune system of an unvaccinated person, allows the SARS-CoV-2 virus to enter the body, breed and mutate, and then shed itself off to vaccinated people?? Or, are you saying that less than 5% of the population(unvaccinated), is responsible for all the infections, deaths, and serious illnesses of 95% of the population(vaccinated)? Both rationales are hard to believe. Because, after almost 80M tests, less than 1% of the population is even infected. How do you reconcile this fact??

And you , you "thick as pig shit" imbecile think that people should just leave it up to their immune systems and have no protection at all. Are you seriously that stupid or evil ????

I do think that anyone who feels safer being vaccinated should CHOOSE to be vaccinated. And anyone who is in the high risk groups, should CHOOSE to be vaccinated. Since the mortality rate of this virus has been consistently less than 1%, I just don't see it as an imminent threat to MY life. No matter how overwhelming the hype is.

It's laughable that you dismissed Covid as insignificant as measles. Do you realise hundreds of thousands around the globe died of measles and other diseases like polio without vaccinations. The cases are insignificant today precisely because of vaccines.

Vaccines , including the covid vaccines have saved millions of lives. Would you have rather given them no protection and let them die?

That's just a matter of your interpretation. I don't know if any of that is true or not. But it IS true, that the Covid-19 illness has a mortality rate less than the measles.

Also, Shell, that 98% recovery is a BS figure that you antivaxxers invented. You assumed that about 2% die so rest recover. Think again, shit for brains.

What percentage of people do YOU think actually recover? Data support needed.

Have you heard of long covid? And do you understand that if you get Covid and/or get reinfected from covid you increase the likelihood of blood clots, strokes and other comorbidites???

How do you increase the likelihood of comorbidities? These are chronic on-going illness, that are NOT directly caused by Covid-19. What exactly IS long Covid-19? Does it mean that the virus lies dormant in the body, and after a long period of time, starts to re-infect the host? What is the mechanism that allows for this to happen?

Go right ahead, idiot, exercise your freedom not to get jabbed but don't try to fool anyone that they are not being protected by the vaccine or that they're not protecting others.

Now, fuck-off dog breath.

I don't give a shit about being protected from being infected by this flu virus. That would be impossible! But I do give a shit about the government injecting ANYTHING into my arm(and my kids) for the rest of my life. What you choose to do with your body is your business. NOT MINE. We have our freedom of choice back. That is all that matters to me. And, if the government ever tries to take it away again, they'll also see the door. So anything out of your twisted and convoluted mouth, is absolutely irrelevant!

When's your next top-up dumb-dumb?

 

[Linus]

This is stupid in action. Not only is she off-topic. She doesn't seem to remember that we've gone through her crap in another thread. But the broken record plays on.

Shell wrote:

So viruses are now tiny fleas, jumping from body to body??

Is that how you see it, Shell? Where did I write anything like that?

You would know, hopefully, that viral particles can be transmitted in the droplets from your sneezes and coughs from people infected with it and if you inhale those droplets you too can become infected.

They also can linger on any surface for some time before degrading. If touch said surfaces you can introduce them into your body with your your hands or fingers coming into contact with your eyes, nose , ears or mouth.

Shell wrote:

If vaccinations stop the virus, so that it doesn't jump to my body, then WHY are fully vaccinated people still being infected and reinfected??

I've already answered this elsewhere and here. The vaccines protect you. Vaccinated people are less likely to get seriously ill or die from the virus. I referenced the NSW Health data in the other thread. I have already told you in this one that from that data the majority of hospitalisations come from the unvaccinated. And of the vaccinated that are in hospital those who have four shots represent a tiniest proportion. There are other real world studies.

You can look here:

Effectiveness of COVID‐19 vaccines: findings from real world studies

Community- based studies in five countries show consistent strong benefits from early rollouts of COVID-19 vaccines

www.mja.com.au

Shell wrote:

WHY are fully vaccinated people still dying?? WHY are fully vaccinated people still developing serious symptoms??

Another pointless question that you keep returning to. Are you trying to claim that vaccinated people aren't doing better than the vaccinated in all those aspects? Real world evidence confirms that they are.

Are you making the absurd proposition that if the vaccine doesn't give you 100% protection then it useless and don't take it?

 

[Linus]

Shell continues with her stupid tirade.

Shell wrote:

I don't give a shit about being protected from being infected by this flu virus. That would be impossible!

And you don't give a shit in protecting others you come in contact with. That's clear.

What do you mean by infected, Shell? I think you're using the word rather loosely and ambiguously in an attempt to deceive. So, tell us what infection means to you.

BTW if you didn't give a shit about protection why did you even argue about it before ad nauseum in the other thread?


Shell wrote:

But I do give a shit about the government injecting ANYTHING into my arm(and my kids) for the rest of my life.

So, Shell, do you give a shit about the government demanding that you use seat belts or obey traffic lights or other laws for the rest of your life? Just asking.

Thing is , Shell, people take annual flu shots to protect themselves and those around them from coming down with constantly mutationg flu's , which could if not taken result in serious illness or death for many.

You're just being totally irrational.

Do you think flu shots are "shit in the arm"? If so, why are they shit in your arm?

Whilst you're there why are Covid vaccines "shit in your arm"?

Are you going to go the same course arguing ingredients, unknown long term effects, ethics etc again? All of which were refuted in the other thread.

Shell wrote:

What you choose to do with your body is your business. NOT MINE.

Here you display your self-centredness, Shell. It's not just your body. It's other people's bodies too that you should care about. Stop the virus in you and you stop the virus spreading to someone vulnerable.

What would you think and feel Shell, if you caught the virus and transmitted the virus to your parents, husband or children and they got seriously ill or died as a result, whilst knowing that if you were fully vaccinated that they may have been spared?

It's happened Shell. It could happen to you.

We have our freedom of choice back. That is all that matters to me.

You mean YOUR freedom of choice, Shell, and bugger the rest of us if that's limited for you in any way, eh?

And you got your freedom of choice back through the very vaccines you've spent days decrying.

You never lost your freedom of choice. Well, not entirely. You could choose to take a tested, safe and effective vaccine or not. You could wear a mask or not. Of course, if you chose not to, it was reasonably demanded, in the prevailing circumstances, that you stay the hell away from the rest of us.

The government took action, with an unknown worldwide viral pandemic, not seen seen before, to protect the population. It's what governments are there to do and they are expected to exercise that function when needed.

We had no vaccines to start with, we had to wait for them, the hospitals would have been overwhelmed by sick and dying patients, the virus would have exponentially ripped through the whole population. It would have been total chaos and god knows how many lives would have been lost.

WTF did you expect them to do? They acted in accordance with the best medical advice. The restrictions and shutdown had bipartisan support.

Here Shell, even The Guardian agreed with the shutdown:

Was Australia right to shut down to slow coronavirus? The economists' verdict

Was Australia right to shut down to slow coronavirus? The economists' verdict

Debate now turns to how quickly to relax Covid-19 restrictions, and whether lockdowns made sense in the first place

www.theguardian.com

Shell wrote:

And, if the government ever tries to take it away again, they'll also see the door.

I don't think your vote or that of your motley bunch of disgruntled antivaxxers could show the government the door. You never had the numbers and you have even less in your ranks now.

Given that the measures had bipartisan support, your dummy spit isn't worth a pinch. But it does show everyone here how self-important and entitled you think you are.


Shell wrote:

So anything out of your twisted and convoluted mouth, is absolutely irrelevant!

Of course, to you it would be totally irrelevant. And thanks for letting us all know why.

Are you finished now?

 

[ausGeoff]

"The overwhelming majority of people infected and dying from this disease are those vaccinated, NOT UNVACCINATED."

I'm surprised at the number of anti-vaxxers who endlessly cite this purported claim.
Of course the number of COVID deaths is greater overall in the vaccinated than in the unvaccinated. That's simply because only around 2% of the population are unvaccinated. It's simple maths which the anti-vaxxers can't comprehend. On a pro rate basis of course it's obviously the unvaccinated who are in hospital, in ICU, and dying.

And around 98% of Australian patients in ICU are unvaccinated.

From Scientific American:

 

[greggerypeccary]

"The overwhelming majority of people infected and dying from this disease are those vaccinated, NOT UNVACCINATED."

I'm surprised at the number of anti-vaxxers who endlessly cite this purported claim.

I'm not.

These people are inherently stupid.

They don't understand basic maths; they aren't reasonable people.

If 100% of the population is vaccinated, 100% of the people being infected with or dying from COVID will be vaccinated.

Basic common sense, based on mathematics.

 

[HBS Guy]

"The overwhelming majority of people infected and dying from this disease are those vaccinated, NOT UNVACCINATED."

I'm surprised at the number of anti-vaxxers who endlessly cite this purported claim.
Of course the number of COVID deaths is greater overall in the vaccinated than in the unvaccinated. That's simply because only around 2% of the population are unvaccinated. It's simple maths which the anti-vaxxers can't comprehend. On a pro rate basis of course it's obviously the unvaccinated who are in hospital, in ICU, and dying.

And around 98% of Australian patients in ICU are unvaccinated.

From Scientific American:
View attachment 1209

Nice to see you here, Geoff! As you see, hammer-and-tongs debate is welcome here!

 

[FutureTheLeftWant]

I'm not.

These people are inherently stupid.

They don't understand basic maths; they aren't reasonable people.

If 100% of the population is vaccinated, 100% of the people being infected with or dying from COVID will be vaccinated.

Basic common sense, based on mathematics.

Precisely. If 40% of people in hospital are unvaccinated and 90% of the population are vaccinated, then being unvaccinated puts you at higher risk

 

[johnsmith]

I had an op booked in private hospital just as lockdown happened… my hubby was at a loss not able to come see me in hospital… and I was alone in the hospital room… which is okay… except for a ghost night nurse that visited and flickered the light … and whispered her name … I asked the nurse in morning if there are any experiences other patients or nurses had…
She said yes she heard storeys some have had experiences.

if you recall my mother passed away during the covid crisis. She spent her last weeks alone in a hospital bed and no one was even allowed to go and say goodbye (until the nurses quietly smuggled her partner in at 3am so he could say his goodbyes) so I understand fully how shitty that feels. But I don't blame the Italian govt. It's was just a shit situation and the govts. duty to protect the greater community outweighed any one persons individual desires. The way I see it, I, and I believe my mum would too, we would feel much worse if her partner, or medical staff, ended up catching covid and dying just because he went in to say goodbye


As for border lockdowns. I was unable to go visit my dad, or my 8 yr old brother, for over 2 years because of the border lock downs. But at least I know they are still alive now and I can go and visit dad whenever I want now. He's an old man who had had previous heart trouble, it would have been to easy for my or my kids to have covid and not even notice, and then give it to him. If our absence helped keep him safe than I'm glad for it.

Again, a politicians duty is to the greater good.

 

[johnsmith]

how greatful I was that we lived on acreage.
But I am empathic for the businesses that struggled and closed down…

I heard someone on an interview with an economist just a couple of days ago say that there were LESS business bankruptcies during the covid lockdowns than there are typically in any one year. As a result we are experiencing a higher number of bankruptcies this year as those that should have shut down the last two years but didn't because of govt. aid, are now finding they are unable to survive. Sure businesses did it tough, but thats business in itself. There are NEVER any guarantees in business and to suceed a business has to be adaptable. Many businesses that were able to adapt absolutely thrived during the lockdowns.

 

[FutureTheLeftWant]

if you recall my mother passed away during the covid crisis. She spent her last weeks alone in a hospital bed and no one was even allowed to go and say goodbye (until the nurses quietly smuggled her partner in at 3am so he could say his goodbyes) so I understand fully how shitty that feels. But I don't blame the Italian govt. It's was just a shit situation and the govts. duty to protect the greater community outweighed any one persons individual desires. The way I see it, I, and I believe my mum would too, we would feel much worse if her partner, or medical staff, ended up catching covid and dying just because he went in to say goodbye


As for border lockdowns. I was unable to go visit my dad, or my 8 yr old brother, for over 2 years because of the border lock downs. But at least I know they are still alive now and I can go and visit dad whenever I want now. He's an old man who had had previous heart trouble, it would have been to easy for my or my kids to have covid and not even notice, and then give it to him. If our absence helped keep him safe than I'm glad for it.

Again, a politicians duty is to the greater good.

No complaining about how bad it was, changes that it was necessary

 

[johnsmith]

All that restriction may have slown down the virus spread but it didn’t stop it at all.
And neither is the covid vax stopping it

the restrictions were NEVER about stopping the virus. They were to there to stop our health services from being inundated. Sure covid is out there but for the majority of people their reaction to it is less severe. Even with that, our health system is struggling. Can you imagine the chaos if our health system had ten times the number currently being hospitalised?

 

[johnsmith]

So why not enforce mask mandates at least?

because of people like you who whinged when he did enforce it

 

[FutureTheLeftWant]

the restrictions were NEVER about stopping the virus. They were to there to stop our health services from being inundated. Sure covid is out there but for the majority of people their reaction to it is less severe. Even with that, our health system is struggling. Can you imagine the chaos if our health system had ten times the number currently being hospitalised?

Exactly, we were trying to space out infections so hospitals could cope

 

[johnsmith]

If I had my way, your ass would be the first I'd boot out. You offer nothing, know nothing, defend nothing, and pretend and avoid everything.

I don't give a rats-ass whether you boot me out or not. Now, go back into your echo chamber and give your ego a good stroke! Just another dumb non-response I've come to expect!

whereas you reel off page after page of pretending you have a clue whilst ignoring the facts

 

[Linus]

Have you ever watched those "Karen" clips on Youtube?

 

[johnsmith]

Which one is Shell?

 

[HBS Guy]

Measles, “a normal, minor childhood disease” is now making a comeback thanks to idiot antivaxxers not having their children vaccinated. This includes children dying from measles—how sick is that? I put it down to idiots wanting excitement in their life even at the expense of their childrens lives.

The “rationale” these antivaxxers give is that the vaccinations cause autism and they quote a physician who had his licence to practice medicine revoked. ummm Wakefield if I remember correctly?

Seems the age for some vaxxes is also the age autism shows up.

 

[HBS Guy]

Which one is Shell?

All of them!